To all thous Victor meldrew's out there

I love my football club and want them to succeed and get back into the football league like I'm sure every town fan does. I understand the football in the first 3 games hasn't been brilliant but apart from 1 silly mistake in the middle of the park leading to our only goal against us. I think we have been solid at the back and hopefully with more of our attacking players coming back our fortunes and performances on the pitch will change soon. We are only 3 games in and still unbeaten. Go on a good run in the next few games and the first 3 will be a distant memory. How about backing the lads at every opportunity and try get more positive vibes back at the park. I sit in the upper and a bunch of old farts behind me just complain all game and it gets right on my mammaries. All I hear is "Rubbish and get him off" I'm sure it does the players confidence loads of good. Not! Anyone would think it was the end of the season and we had no chance of promotion. We have loads of games left to change it round and defo more chance now we have players coming back. I think the negativity coming from some fans is a little wrong and premature considering the recent luck with injury's etc. If you want your team to do well and succeed how ever you dislike the manager etc. Surly getting behind your team and trying to create a positive atmosphere around the place is going to help more with motivating the players than shouting negative comments all the time when things aren't going to plan so early in the season. So to all thous grumpy victor meldrews out there smile and try to be more positive for a change it's not all that bad!Positivity breeds success. Utm

Quoted from The Singing Fisherman

I love my football club and want them to succeed and get back into the football league like I'm sure every town fan does. I understand the football in the first 3 games hasn't been brilliant but apart from 1 silly mistake in the middle of the park leading to our only goal against us. I think we have been solid at the back and hopefully with more of our attacking players coming back our fortunes and performances on the pitch will change soon. We are only 3 games in and still unbeaten. Go on a good run in the next few games and the first 3 will be a distant memory. How about backing the lads at every opportunity and try get more positive vibes back at the park. I sit in the upper and a bunch of old farts behind me just complain all game and it gets right on my mammaries. All I hear is "Rubbish and get him off" I'm sure it does the players confidence loads of good. Not! Anyone would think it was the end of the season and we had no chance of promotion. We have loads of games left to change it round and defo more chance now we have players coming back. I think the negativity coming from some fans is a little wrong and premature considering the recent luck with injury's etc. If you want your team to do well and succeed how ever you dislike the manager etc. Surly getting behind your team and trying to create a positive atmosphere around the place is going to help more with motivating the players than shouting negative comments all the time when things aren't going to plan so early in the season. So to all thous grumpy victor meldrews out there smile and try to be more positive for a change it's not all that bad!Positivity breeds success. Utm

I don't believe it....

Optimism and positiveness in most fans has been in short supply since we dropped into the conference.  We can't beat part-time clubs and understandably we want to get out of this league asap.  I have always been a positive fan, but like others, now cannot bear the thought of us messing up again!  Even 3 games in, we should have 7 points and we have just 3, but from the way we've played (in the last 2) there is no reason to think we live up to being faves for the league with Hurst and Fenty leading the club.  The next 2 games are must wins and I hope we do have 9pts come Monday eve, this will in some way, help us feel slightly positive again.  Here's hoping?

Unbelievable !!!!!!!!!!

Quoted from The Singing Fisherman

I love my football club and want them to succeed and get back into the football league like I'm sure every town fan does. I understand the football in the first 3 games hasn't been brilliant but apart from 1 silly mistake in the middle of the park leading to our only goal against us. I think we have been solid at the back and hopefully with more of our attacking players coming back our fortunes and performances on the pitch will change soon. We are only 3 games in and still unbeaten. Go on a good run in the next few games and the first 3 will be a distant memory. How about backing the lads at every opportunity and try get more positive vibes back at the park. I sit in the upper and a bunch of old farts behind me just complain all game and it gets right on my mammaries. All I hear is "Rubbish and get him off" I'm sure it does the players confidence loads of good. Not! Anyone would think it was the end of the season and we had no chance of promotion. We have loads of games left to change it round and defo more chance now we have players coming back. I think the negativity coming from some fans is a little wrong and premature considering the recent luck with injury's etc. If you want your team to do well and succeed how ever you dislike the manager etc. Surly getting behind your team and trying to create a positive atmosphere around the place is going to help more with motivating the players than shouting negative comments all the time when things aren't going to plan so early in the season. So to all thous grumpy victor meldrews out there smile and try to be more positive for a change it's not all that bad!Positivity breeds success. Utm

Much easier to get behind a team that comes out looking like it wants to attack and create some belief.

The Paul Hurst mentality is of someone who knows that their time is up. It's anti the press and anti the fans. Every home game should be gung-ho from the start to put the fear of God into teams like Dover - instead we get the 'don't under-estimate them' 'it was a good point all things considered' crap that everyone is fed up with.

Surly/surely it's time that the custodians of this club realise that to get the fans behind them is to be positive not negative in both attitude and deed because it strikes me that most fans are just sat there waiting for shitto happen. Give the fans something to cheer and they will cheer, some (like me) might come back and we might get back to a situation where BP becomes a fortress again. Unless and until, I fear it won't.

Quoted from MuddyWaters

Much easier to get behind a team that comes out looking like it wants to attack and create some belief.

The Paul Hurst mentality is of someone who knows that their time is up. It's anti the press and anti the fans. Every home game should be gung-ho from the start to put the fear of God into teams like Dover - instead we get the 'don't under-estimate them' 'it was a good point all things considered' crap that everyone is fed up with.

Surly/surely it's time that the custodians of this club realise that to get the fans behind them is to be positive not negative in both attitude and deed because it strikes me that most fans are just sat there waiting for shitto happen. Give the fans something to cheer and they will cheer, some (like me) might come back and we might get back to a situation where BP becomes a fortress again. Unless and until, I fear it won't.

I understand it works both ways. But surely we will get more of a true idea how the season is going to pan out once all our attacking players are back. Just think it's a little earlier to take the negative stance just yet. Hopefully a good wkd this one coming and things will feel a little different. Utm

But it's not just 3 f**king games it's since Scott and Hurst have been here and more recently Paul on his own!!!  It's the same old shite every game we haven't moved forward for at least 2 and a half years.  The clocks ticking and i can't see any improvement whatsoever while ph is in charge

Yeah he's turned us from mid table non league hopers into play off no hopers we need someone who will take  us that next level I  can't see it within Paul Hurst

Next two games are must win!
Interesting... why are they must win??

Hyperbole and gross exaggeration I believe

Point at Gateshead and win v Alfreton and the bunting will be out in Cleethorpes.. trust me

Quoted from pizzzza

I don't believe it....

Beat me to it.  

Quoted from Stevie Saunders

Next two games are must win!
Interesting... why are they must win??

Hyperbole and gross exaggeration I believe

Point at Gateshead and win v Alfreton and the bunting will be out in Cleethorpes.. trust me

Negative , going for a point at gateshead . That's what some people are trying to get across.

I won't be happy for a point at gateshead and until that mentality changes this club will be down here for years to come

For gods sake it's gateshead with 800 poxy fans in the ground

I respect what you are trying to say The Singing Fisherman but people need to vent their frustrations and it is better that they do it on the fishy than at the game.

Not everyone who boos the players or complains at the match reads or posts on the fishy.

Its not 3 games ,its been since christmas,, and if you look at the wider view, we are no better off league wise than when neil woods was in charge .. same league different year

Quoted from The Singing Fisherman

I understand it works both ways. But surely we will get more of a true idea how the season is going to pan out once all our attacking players are back. Just think it's a little earlier to take the negative stance just yet. Hopefully a good wkd this one coming and things will feel a little different. Utm

Really admire your enthusiasm and optimistic view , I really hope you prove every doubter wrong .UTM

Quoted from The Singing Fisherman

I love my football club and want them to succeed and get back into the football league like I'm sure every town fan does. I understand the football in the first 3 games hasn't been brilliant but apart from 1 silly mistake in the middle of the park leading to our only goal against us. I think we have been solid at the back and hopefully with more of our attacking players coming back our fortunes and performances on the pitch will change soon. We are only 3 games in and still unbeaten. Go on a good run in the next few games and the first 3 will be a distant memory. How about backing the lads at every opportunity and try get more positive vibes back at the park. I sit in the upper and a bunch of old farts behind me just complain all game and it gets right on my mammaries. All I hear is "Rubbish and get him off" I'm sure it does the players confidence loads of good. Not! Anyone would think it was the end of the season and we had no chance of promotion. We have loads of games left to change it round and defo more chance now we have players coming back. I think the negativity coming from some fans is a little wrong and premature considering the recent luck with injury's etc. If you want your team to do well and succeed how ever you dislike the manager etc. Surly getting behind your team and trying to create a positive atmosphere around the place is going to help more with motivating the players than shouting negative comments all the time when things aren't going to plan so early in the season. So to all thous grumpy victor meldrews out there smile and try to be more positive for a change it's not all that bad!Positivity breeds success. Utm

And breath

A shame that any attempt at unifying fans and creating a bit of positivity on this board gets hijacked by the moaning brigade. If we'd won the first 3 games would this board be full of praise for the team and endless repetitive threads about how great we are? Not sure if it's human nature / football supporters nature or Grimsby nature but a lot of people prefer moaning than praising the team - if you need evidence look at how busy this board is after a defeat compared to after a win.

Quoted from ackomariner

Negative , going for a point at gateshead . That's what some people are trying to get across.

I won't be happy for a point at gateshead and until that mentality changes this club will be down here for years to come

For gods sake it's gateshead with 800 poxy fans in the ground

I don't often agree with 80s but I do believe he is right when he says that if Town "went for it" on Saturday and ended up getting beaten convincingly the Fishy on Saturday night would require an X certificate (one for the more mature in age amongst us).

As for your last comment, when league positions are decided on the size of crowds I'll join your argument. Gateshead are a side who, despite some underhand tactics know how to play the game. With a better start to last season they could well have found themselves starting this campaign in the Football League...

I would dearly love 3 points on Saturday but would accept a point if it were offered now...

Quoted from barralad

As for your last comment, when league positions are decided on the size of crowds I'll join your argument. Gateshead are a side who, despite some underhand tactics know how to play the game. With a better start to last season they could well have found themselves starting this campaign in the Football League...

We could do with some underhand tactics. No, hold on, let's just start with tactics for now........

Quoted from The Singing Fisherman

I love my football club and want them to succeed and get back into the football league like I'm sure every town fan does. I understand the football in the first 3 games hasn't been brilliant but apart from 1 silly mistake in the middle of the park leading to our only goal against us. I think we have been solid at the back and hopefully with more of our attacking players coming back our fortunes and performances on the pitch will change soon. We are only 3 games in and still unbeaten. Go on a good run in the next few games and the first 3 will be a distant memory. How about backing the lads at every opportunity and try get more positive vibes back at the park. I sit in the upper and a bunch of old farts behind me just complain all game and it gets right on my mammaries. All I hear is "Rubbish and get him off" I'm sure it does the players confidence loads of good. Not! Anyone would think it was the end of the season and we had no chance of promotion. We have loads of games left to change it round and defo more chance now we have players coming back. I think the negativity coming from some fans is a little wrong and premature considering the recent luck with injury's etc. If you want your team to do well and succeed how ever you dislike the manager etc. Surly getting behind your team and trying to create a positive atmosphere around the place is going to help more with motivating the players than shouting negative comments all the time when things aren't going to plan so early in the season. So to all thous grumpy victor meldrews out there smile and try to be more positive for a change it's not all that bad!Positivity breeds success. Utm

Don't tell me - you also go to the away games with Getyourfactsright, right?

"Negativity a little premature" - weve been on the slide for 10 years!

If you think our fans are bad you should have read the Luton fans sites till they eventually got it together.

There are always a few moans and groans at every ground in the country from Old Trafford down, but I think the fans have been incredibly lenient towards the "board" and team considering the circumstances.

I think that may change though unless there really is an upturn soon, which to be fair is probable when we get a full team out.

I don't support those who moan at games for no apparent reason, but I do wish that the club (JF /PH etc.)would give a little more credit to the 90% of fans who attend in very decent numbers to support our beloved team, bearing in mind the standard of entertainment on offer lately.
Sure I'd like to see 5000 in the ground, but 3500+ paying £18 per game is no mean feat

Quoted from barralad

I don't often agree with 80s but I do believe he is right when he says that if Town "went for it" on Saturday and ended up getting beaten convincingly the Fishy on Saturday night would require an X certificate (one for the more mature in age amongst us).

Well just to be clear I'm not suggesting that IDEALLY it isn't generally the right thing to do.
Generally (and I emphasis this word !) I believe we should strive to attack more. (not that we didn't try all we could on Saturday IMO)

While I personally don't subscribe to the view we should play the very strongest side with a key game due 2 days later, I also see Heed as an opportunity to get match time into many returning players in need of mins under their belt.
(I guess some will still view this as this as unnecessary "squad rotation" !  )

But as you've indicated the heart of the problem perhaps lies in people's reactions.

If we were to go there with an understrength team (perhaps mainly in terms of fitness), attack, fight like lions, put in a great performance and ultimately lose narrowly I would STILL be concerned whether fans would question Hurst's tactics.
Regardless of whether they agreed to "go for it" and what the level of performance was on the day.

In conclusion, perhaps until fans start cutting the team some slack that allows them to express themselves more freely without fear of reprisal, fans objecting to "negative tactics" are likely to receive those very same tactics they object to and whose outcome of any other more attacking alternative (they wish for) they still ultimately refuse to gracefully accept as "part and parcel of football".

i.e. if fans want the manager to attack more, they should be prepared to gracefully accept the outcome (since it's the tactics THEY wanted) praising the players efforts for trying even if it goes wrong.

Ironically I've already canvassed the opinion of 1 fishy member who said he wanted the team to take more risks and attack more but freely admitted he would still moan if those same tactics he fully subscribed to ended in defeat !  

As a "Victor Meldrew", I don't object to positivity or calls for positivity.

I object to the inference that we're moaning because we've not been good these last 3 games.

Quoted from Vance Warner

A shame that any attempt at unifying fans and creating a bit of positivity on this board gets hijacked by the moaning brigade. If we'd won the first 3 games would this board be full of praise for the team and endless repetitive threads about how great we are? Not sure if it's human nature / football supporters nature or Grimsby nature but a lot of people prefer moaning than praising the team - if you need evidence look at how busy this board is after a defeat compared to after a win.

You can't start a call for unity an positivity by having a moan at the people you perceive as negative though can you?

I mean, how would it sound if I said "why don't you self-righteous, happy-clappers stop having a go at the people who believe they make valid criticisms and join with us"? Wouldn't work would it.

A positive call for unity would be something like:
We all have different views and are entitled to them, but we're all here because we love Grimsby Town FC, so let's avoid the name-calling and get 100% behind which ever team takes the field on Saturday for the full duration of the match. Make some noise and create a great atmosphere.

Quoted from Vance Warner

A shame that any attempt at unifying fans and creating a bit of positivity on this board gets hijacked by the moaning brigade. If we'd won the first 3 games would this board be full of praise for the team and endless repetitive threads about how great we are? Not sure if it's human nature / football supporters nature or Grimsby nature but a lot of people prefer moaning than praising the team - if you need evidence look at how busy this board is after a defeat compared to after a win.

So if your not in the rose tinted camp and can see Town are in trouble your moaning.
What a load of boll0cks you spout.

Quoted from KingstonMariner

I object to the inference that we're moaning because we've not been good these last 3 games.

So what's your gripe then ?

Quoted from The Singing Fisherman

I love my football club and want them to succeed and get back into the football league like I'm sure every town fan does. I understand the football in the first 3 games hasn't been brilliant but apart from 1 silly mistake in the middle of the park leading to our only goal against us. I think we have been solid at the back and hopefully with more of our attacking players coming back our fortunes and performances on the pitch will change soon. We are only 3 games in and still unbeaten. Go on a good run in the next few games and the first 3 will be a distant memory. How about backing the lads at every opportunity and try get more positive vibes back at the park. I sit in the upper and a bunch of old farts behind me just complain all game and it gets right on my mammaries. All I hear is "Rubbish and get him off" I'm sure it does the players confidence loads of good. Not! Anyone would think it was the end of the season and we had no chance of promotion. We have loads of games left to change it round and defo more chance now we have players coming back. I think the negativity coming from some fans is a little wrong and premature considering the recent luck with injury's etc. If you want your team to do well and succeed how ever you dislike the manager etc. Surly getting behind your team and trying to create a positive atmosphere around the place is going to help more with motivating the players than shouting negative comments all the time when things aren't going to plan so early in the season. So to all thous grumpy victor meldrews out there smile and try to be more positive for a change it's not all that bad!Positivity breeds success. Utm

I've heard all this excrement before and nothing seems to change  

Quoted from Stevie Saunders

Next two games are must win!
Interesting... why are they must win??

Hyperbole and gross exaggeration I believe

Point at Gateshead and win v Alfreton and the bunting will be out in Cleethorpes.. trust me

Tautology, I believe

Quoted from TAGG

So if your not in the rose tinted camp and can see Town are in trouble your moaning.
What a load of boll0cks you spout.

Thanks for your intelligent reply. I don't consider myself in one camp or another. The point I was making is that there's a lot of criticism with a lack of realistic suggestions of how to improve - in a lot of cases this comes across as moaning. I look forward to this board being full of positivity the next time we put a good run together but I won't hold my breath.

Quoted from Saudimariner

Tautology, I believe

Classic!

As an exile from GY of thirty years I still find myself defending and proclaiming the natural freindliness, despite the Towns problems, of the people.  It appears that quite a high percentage on this message board either:- aren't representative of the average Grimbarian, or my exile has left me sadly out of touch.  A constructive argument should be precisely that, consideration of anothers views while countering with your own well thought out response.  Is it therefore possible for the normally rational to respond without abuse or trying to ridicule using percieved intelligence as a tool?  After all, anyone can appear intelligent in type!

On to the in/out and favourites argument.  My opinion for what it's worth (feel free to counter) is that we continue to under-perform given the resource and quality at the clubs disposal. Under performance is corrosive and is detrimental to the long term success of the club as both a leisure outlet and a business enterprise.  The issue is that the 'voice of the Customer', evident at matches and social medium, isn't being listened to or countered with factual evidence.  I suspect like most people, I long ago accepted that we have no divine right to expect success and that there are inevitably periods at any club where aspirations aren't met.  It's simply been too long at BP since anyones aspirations have been met.  I therefore urge the board to carry out a rapid appraisal of the likelihood of success under the current managerial setup and act accordingly on their findings.

UTM

Quoted from GorgeousGeorge

As an exile from GY of thirty years I still find myself defending and proclaiming the natural freindliness, despite the Towns problems, of the people.  It appears that quite a high percentage on this message board either:- aren't representative of the average Grimbarian, or my exile has left me sadly out of touch.  A constructive argument should be precisely that, consideration of anothers views while countering with your own well thought out response.  Is it therefore possible for the normally rational to respond without abuse or trying to ridicule using percieved intelligence as a tool?  After all, anyone can appear intelligent in type!

On to the in/out and favourites argument.  My opinion for what it's worth (feel free to counter) is that we continue to under-perform given the resource and quality at the clubs disposal. Under performance is corrosive and is detrimental to the long term success of the club as both a leisure outlet and a business enterprise.  The issue is that the 'voice of the Customer', evident at matches and social medium, isn't being listened to or countered with factual evidence.  I suspect like most people, I long ago accepted that we have no divine right to expect success and that there are inevitably periods at any club where aspirations aren't met.  It's simply been too long at BP since anyones aspirations have been met.  I therefore urge the board to carry out a rapid appraisal of the likelihood of success under the current managerial setup and act accordingly on their findings.

UTM

Great post - in essence the customer is king, the same as in any other business involved in the entertainment industry.

Quoted from TAGG

So if your not in the rose tinted camp and can see Town are in trouble your moaning.
What a load of boll0cks you spout.

I wish I had said that, Whistler
You will, Oscar, you will.....

Quoted from GorgeousGeorge

As an exile from GY of thirty years I still find myself defending and proclaiming the natural freindliness, despite the Towns problems, of the people.  It appears that quite a high percentage on this message board either:- aren't representative of the average Grimbarian, or my exile has left me sadly out of touch.  A constructive argument should be precisely that, consideration of anothers views while countering with your own well thought out response.  Is it therefore possible for the normally rational to respond without abuse or trying to ridicule using percieved intelligence as a tool?  After all, anyone can appear intelligent in type!

On to the in/out and favourites argument.  My opinion for what it's worth (feel free to counter) is that we continue to under-perform given the resource and quality at the clubs disposal. Under performance is corrosive and is detrimental to the long term success of the club as both a leisure outlet and a business enterprise.  The issue is that the 'voice of the Customer', evident at matches and social medium, isn't being listened to or countered with factual evidence.  I suspect like most people, I long ago accepted that we have no divine right to expect success and that there are inevitably periods at any club where aspirations aren't met.  It's simply been too long at BP since anyones aspirations have been met.  I therefore urge the board to carry out a rapid appraisal of the likelihood of success under the current managerial setup and act accordingly on their findings.

UTM

Good post  

Quoted from GorgeousGeorge

My opinion for what it's worth (feel free to counter) is that we continue to under-perform given the resource and quality at the clubs disposal.

I would counter that due to the appaling injury situation we've been suffering, the amount of available quality has been significantly reduced (see YTS on bench) and the amount of under-performance therefore been grossly exagerrated (even by 3000 frustrated souls) probably due to the frustration of not winning previous games.

Quoted from GorgeousGeorge

The issue is that the 'voice of the Customer', evident at matches and social medium, isn't being listened to or countered with factual evidence.

With all due respect guess you can't have been reading the very many reasoned arguments on the forum or listening to the manager or RH very much then !

Quoted from 120797

I would counter that due to the appaling injury situation we've been suffering, the amount of available quality has been significantly reduced (see YTS on bench) and the amount of under-performance therefore been grossly exagerrated (even by 3000 frustrated souls) probably due to the frustration of not winning previous games.

80s why were we under performing after Christmas last season when he had his full squad to chose from.

Ph said again before this season started that we've got a smaller squad, but better quality. So I'm not having all these excuses anymore about injuries , suspensions, bla,bla,bla......

If the young first team pros aren't going to be played, why sign them on pro forms? At the end of the day we've got the players but ph in his wisdom won't put them in

Quoted from ackomariner

80s why were we under performing after Christmas last season when he had his full squad to chose from.

From memory and without looking at the fixture list (wasn't working on the OS for 13/14 when I last tried !), guessing a combination of massive fixture backlog and perhaps "Don't take more risks than you need to to get into the playoffs" Hursty type thing.
PS I'm assuming you're right that we were under performing by the way !

Quoted from ackomariner

Ph said again before this season started that we've got a smaller squad, but better quality. So I'm not having all these excuses anymore about injuries , suspensions, bla,bla,bla......

Sorry you've lost me.
It's the QUALITY (Arnold, Pittman, Neilson etc) we've been missing ?

Quoted from ackomariner

If the young first team pros aren't going to be played, why sign them on pro forms? At the end of the day we've got the players but ph in his wisdom won't put them in

Generally with you on this one !

I thought Winfarrah should have played too but perhaps there are good reasons he didn't.
Perhaps wing back needs different skills to left back or he was saving him for future games at left back ?
Or maybe he's mainly focusing on coaching the lad to develop to make the club a few quid long term ?

Anyway it's all speculation, guess the reasons might come out in the wash at some point. (wish they would !)

I certainly want us to trust youth more at 1st team level whenever possible because I think it could help them develop.

Quoted from ackomariner

80s why were we under performing after Christmas last season when he had his full squad to chose from.

Ph said again before this season started that we've got a smaller squad, but better quality. So I'm not having all these excuses anymore about injuries , suspensions, bla,bla,bla......

If the young first team pros aren't going to be played, why sign them on pro forms? At the end of the day we've got the players but ph in his wisdom won't put them in

Are you suffering from selective memory?  Firstly:- The same manager was in charge of a team that from September through to 4:45 on January 5 performed generally very well (I'll gloss over Halifax away ) including beating two league teams in the FA Cup and pushing another one pretty close.

Secondly:- I would suggest that the fixture congestion at least had a bearing on our dip in form. We played 15 games in 49 days during March and April. There was a vociferous debate on here around that time about playing the same team for most of those games and Hurst was hammered when he played some fringe players away at Dartford TWO days before another game.

Thirdly:- You cannot possibly be serious about your comment "I'm not having this about injuries suspensions etc." We have had the majority of our attack minded players injured at the same time. Teams a lot higher up the pyramid would struggle to cope with the loss of two forwards and a speedy winger.

Don't you mean 2 speedy wingers (Mackreth, Arnold) barra ?

[Before anyone says Winfarrah, you generally need 1 winger each side]

Quoted from 120797

So what's your gripe then ?

Oh do keep up.

Quoted from 120797

From memory and without looking at the fixture list (wasn't working on the OS for 13/14 when I last tried !), guessing a combination of massive fixture backlog and perhaps "Don't take more risks than you need to to get into the playoffs" Hursty type thing.
PS I'm assuming you're right that we were under performing by the way !


Sorry you've lost me.
It's the QUALITY (Arnold, Pittman, Neilson etc) we've been missing ?


Generally with you on this one !

I thought Winfarrah should have played too but perhaps there are good reasons he didn't.
Perhaps wing back needs different skills to left back or he was saving him for future games at left back ?
Or maybe he's mainly focusing on coaching the lad to develop to make the club a few quid long term ?

Anyway it's all speculation, guess the reasons might come out in the wash at some point. (wish they would !)

I certainly want us to trust youth more at 1st team level whenever possible because I think it could help them develop.

How about the season before when Scott n Hurst started the great non-scoring striker experiment.

Seen nothing to change my first impression since that game at Dartford.

Quoted from Vance Warner

Thanks for your intelligent reply. I don't consider myself in one camp or another. The point I was making is that there's a lot of criticism with a lack of realistic suggestions of how to improve - in a lot of cases this comes across as moaning. I look forward to this board being full of positivity the next time we put a good run together but I won't hold my breath.

"lack of realistic suggestions of how to improve"  
Read the posts there are plenty suggesting that getting rid of this manager would improve our situation.
Maybe you cant see those posts through your rose tints  

Quoted from KingstonMariner

How about the season before when Scott n Hurst started the great non-scoring striker experiment.

Seen nothing to change my first impression since that game at Dartford.

Sorry can't remember every single game off the top of my head.
You'll just have to expand on your point instead.

Quoted from TAGG

"lack of realistic suggestions of how to improve"  
Read the posts there are plenty suggesting that getting rid of this manager would improve our situation.
Maybe you cant see those posts through your rose tints  

Firstly I would argue that getting rid of the manager after three draws is not realistic.

Secondly getting rid of the manger will only improve our situation if we replace him with someone better. I'm not hearing any realistic suggestions on who that would be. In my 25 years following town changing manger has usually had a negative impact. It's not very often we've sacked a manger and replaced him with someone better - Woods for Hurst/Scott is probably one of the better examples!

Quoted from 120797

From memory and without looking at the fixture list (wasn't working on the OS for 13/14 when I last tried !), guessing a combination of massive fixture backlog and perhaps "Don't take more risks than you need to to get into the playoffs" Hursty type thing.
PS I'm assuming you're right that we were under performing by the way !


Sorry you've lost me.
It's the QUALITY (Arnold, Pittman, Neilson etc) we've been missing ?


Generally with you on this one !

I thought Winfarrah should have played too but perhaps there are good reasons he didn't.
Perhaps wing back needs different skills to left back or he was saving him for future games at left back ?
Or maybe he's mainly focusing on coaching the lad to develop to make the club a few quid long term ?

Anyway it's all speculation, guess the reasons might come out in the wash at some point. (wish they would !)

I certainly want us to trust youth more at 1st team level whenever possible because I think it could help them develop.

Think it's a bit early to be using Arnold and Pitman as a defence they may turn out to be a bag of excrement as they've not a proper run in the team yet.

Maybe you're right.
Gonna need a few games to get fully fit and be performing at 100% anyway.
Probably far too early to judge.

I've read the pro and anti Hurst arguments on here with great interest, for what its
worth my opinion is that  sacking him 3 games into the season is a bit too early, but
equally there are worrying signs already that his somewhat limited tactics in the final third
are still there and unless the returning players add a bit of flair with an ability to unlock
stubborn defensives and start scoring a few goals, his time will be limited IMHO.
Positive tactics needed ,not just a dour stubborn 'we must not lose' mentality i feel.

How about brining in an attacking coach,even if it is Sir Matt Tees down at Cheapside teaching L.J.L. how to head a ball better than what we have got at the moment.

Quoted from petethemariner

I've read the pro and anti Hurst arguments on here with great interest, for what its
worth my opinion is that  sacking him 3 games into the season is a bit too early, but
equally there are worrying signs already that his somewhat limited tactics in the final third
are still there and unless the returning players add a bit of flair with an ability to unlock
stubborn defensives and start scoring a few goals, his time will be limited IMHO.
Positive tactics needed ,not just a dour stubborn 'we must not lose' mentality i feel.

Fair and balanced summary IMO.

I just think if 3 games in with injuries + suspensions wasn't enough, when it's a missed yard tap in, the width of the post or 6 mins away from 3 pts you've got to to VERY careful what dire conclusions you instantly draw given the recent (if only relative) successes compared to managers previous.
And perhaps even MORE importantly, how such an effect of frustration or doom around the club might affect the teams success (i.e. lack of) going forward !

If we lose today guess some will just ignor the near misses, who we're playing and make out it's the end.
Course it's not still plenty of time...

Not saying Hurst is Mr Positive by any means either but perhaps those criticizing could try more to lead by example if they really want to show him the way to go. (i.e. not out the door, being more positive and successful out on the pitch)
To be fair think he was last game, wasn't shutting up shop ?
Whether the same will be true today after the fallout we'll see ! (really hope so somehow I doubt it !)

If some fans were a bit more positive in their support perhaps they'd have some right to expect the same from the manager too.
Until then I'm not sure they do ?

Let's see how we go come 3pm...

PS I agree with you friskney we arguably need more attacking options but maybe a little patience finding them too ?