So...with the recent flurry of activity in what appears to be a new approach by Hurst to strengthen the team way ahead of January what are the pro's and con's, who are the winners and losers?

Most recently we can cite Ollie Palmer and Richard Brodie as extremes when it comes to signing a striker in January, Brodie was high profile, pretty much a flop and disrupted the squad...Palmer the polar opposite.  
Jones and Alabi, young and largely unheard of, (ala Palmer) signing them now allows us to evaluate and decide ahead of the window in January whether they are cutting it and if not release and try again in the window. Additional competition. Smart move in that way. Pro !
5 strikers now....at least two wont even get on the bench when all fit......additional tinkering for tinkering sakes potential not allowing partnerships to flurrish...pick the loanees and our own strikers confidence gets put out...potential unhappy camp......Cons!!

Conor Henderson....much called for additional centre midfielder...long overdue....again signing now allows us to evaluate and decide ahead of the window in January whether he is cutting it and if not release and try again in the window. Venney and or Clifton probably going out on loan to gain real game time Pro !
Brown, Venney , Clifton effectively being told they are not good enough, unhappy campers...Con !

With three loanees in a week i would assume, based on Hursts usual loanee record,  that come Saturday possibly three of what is supposed to be our strongest squad to date wont even make the bench.....Bogle, Pitman, Marshall, Robertson, East, Brown, Makreth, Pearson...the current likely bench warming candidates...... replaced with young unproven players ..... Con!

I like the early strengthening approach but unless there are unknown injuries or complications with exisiting ones then i cant help thinking Hurst has given himself a selection headache, not only regards the starting 11 but to who makes the bench as well...and this for a team that is just finding a nice run of form.  I would imagine there will be 2/3 heading out before long as a result.

Well you put that better than I did 😄 and this is what worries me, we have a settled team now with good options on the bench we are looking strong, now if  these loans where just a back up for squad cover I'd be more than happy. but I'm judging Hurst on his past mistakes because We have been here before.
I just hope Hurst has learnt from his mistakes because if not we are going to have some very drunk off players in the squad.

...........or it could be Hurst is strengthening is team going into the most important part of the season and hoping to keep a decent cup run going.

Games are going to come thick and fast now he needs quality players to  come in when and if injuries/suspensions take effect.

I for one am glad he is bringing in useful additions maybe he as not been able to extend existing loans another reason to add players. The Alibi one looks like a target man he likes to have and a extra midfield player of quality is a must in my opinion.

Lets see what happens before we start doubting  the appointments it's a squad game.

Strength in depth has to be as good as I can ever remember it, relative to our division at the time. I've been hoping we'll get knocked out of the Trophy nice and early this year, but then you realise that even discounting everyone who started at Eastleigh, we could still field the following side.

                                 Warrington

East              Pearson             [Youth]           Robertson

Mackreth        Brown             Henderson             Marshall

                        Bogle             Pittman

That doesn't even account for Alabi. Don't know much about Henderson, but not a bad 'second string' by any means, if you can even call it that. Only downside of a strong squad is keeping everyone happy - for me whether Hurst succeeds in doing that will dictate whether we win the league, or not.

Quoted from Poojah

Strength in depth has to be as good as I can ever remember it, relative to our division at the time. I've been hoping we'll get knocked out of the Trophy nice and early this year, but then you realise that even discounting everyone who started at Eastleigh, we could still field the following side.

                                 Warrington

East              Pearson             [Youth]           Robertson

Mackreth        Brown             Henderson             Marshall

                        Bogle             Pittman

That doesn't even account for Alabi. Don't know much about Henderson, but not a bad 'second string' by any means, if you can even call it that. Only downside of a strong squad is keeping everyone happy - for me whether Hurst succeeds in doing that will dictate whether we win the league, or not.

Crikey, you'd still expect that team to be top half of the table.

I was thinking this earlier. We've already been having to leave a senior pro or 2 (i.e. aside from Venney/Clifton) out of the matchday squad of 16.

Now with Bogle back in contention and two new signings, we'll have 21 senior players available so 5 aren't even going to make the bench.

Some tough choices ahead for PH, but he's got to be ruthless and improve the team if he can. If these new lads are better than what we've got and can help push us to our goal, then they play. Simple as that for me.

Time will tell but let's all give them a chance and not write them off 2 minutes after they've got on the pitch.

Strength in depth has to be a big step forward.  You never know when we are going to get injuries or suspensions etc.  Particularly,  over the busy xmas period.

A lot of points up for grabs and we need capitalise on these.  

Strength in depth has to be a big step forward.  You never know when we are going to get injuries or suspensions etc.  Particularly,  over the busy xmas period.

A lot of points up for grabs and we need capitalise on these.  

McKeown
Tait Toto Pearson Townsend
Arnold Diz Brown Monkhouse
Amond Pittman

Is the best side for me, but that leaves us with a back up side of

Warrington
East Gowling Sunter Robertson
MacKreth Clay Henderson Marshall
Bogle Alabi (once Jones in all probability goes back)

Saying all this I would send Alabi, Jones and Henderson back in a heartbeat if we could keep Townsend until the end of the season.

I'd sell a kidney and a bollock.

Blundell Park. Friday 27 November. 14:10.

Doig: Paul, Paul, wiv goat Steve Bruce on the phone.

Hurst: What's he want?

Doig: Ah doan nae, but he says he just bought a kidney dish and now he's whistling the Colonel Bogey tune.

Abdul has only got one ball.

glad we have brought in a central midfielder for more competition so we have 4 to fight for 2 spots. I like the fact we are strengthening the squad but worried at the same time as I assumed we got Jones in just to cover for the injuries we've had. Now the boys are all pretty much back and ready I didn't expect another loannee. Just hope it's like some have said and he'll be a 'plan B' option from the bench if things aren't going to plan (a bit like man United and fallanni)

Hurst has the backing of the squad. He's strengthened where needed. We now have the strongest set of players since we've been down here...

Quoted from Abdul19

I'd sell a kidney and a bollock.

I'll have your bollock - it would be nice to have 4 !!!  lol

Quoted from Bristol Mariner

Hurst has the backing of the squad. He's strengthened where needed. We now have the strongest set of players since we've been down here...

I agree - we're on for the treble at this point. In the cups, every win means more money. Great time of the season for optimism.  

Got lots of thoughts on this, but, in the interests of brevity....now, more than ever, we have a situation that pretty much all players need to understand,  and that is that there is fierce competition for places; so much so, that if you're in, and you're not doing the business, chances are you'll be out. Good things and bad things about that, but it ought to force up overall standards in the long run.

I do just want to add - in Amond, Bogle and Pittman we have three superb, contracted strikers. Unsurpassed as a '3' at this level almost certainly. I would like to see them given a chance to continue if they have a below par game in the interests of forging partnerships and understandings.The stats would say that, as goalscoreres, none of them have done too much wrong, and don't need replacing if fit.

Finally---the players will need to respond positively to this and try to play without manifesting their fears of losing their place in the team if they make a mistake. That could seriously inhibit our play. It's a fine line this strategy.

Quoted from moosey_club

So...with the recent flurry of activity in what appears to be a new approach by Hurst to strengthen the team way ahead of January what are the pro's and con's, who are the winners and losers?

Most recently we can cite Ollie Palmer and Richard Brodie as extremes when it comes to signing a striker in January, Brodie was high profile, pretty much a flop and disrupted the squad...Palmer the polar opposite.  
Jones and Alabi, young and largely unheard of, (ala Palmer) signing them now allows us to evaluate and decide ahead of the window in January whether they are cutting it and if not release and try again in the window. Additional competition. Smart move in that way. Pro !
5 strikers now....at least two wont even get on the bench when all fit......additional tinkering for tinkering sakes potential not allowing partnerships to flurrish...pick the loanees and our own strikers confidence gets put out...potential unhappy camp......Cons!!

Conor Henderson....much called for additional centre midfielder...long overdue....again signing now allows us to evaluate and decide ahead of the window in January whether he is cutting it and if not release and try again in the window. Venney and or Clifton probably going out on loan to gain real game time Pro !
Brown, Venney , Clifton effectively being told they are not good enough, unhappy campers...Con !

With three loanees in a week i would assume, based on Hursts usual loanee record,  that come Saturday possibly three of what is supposed to be our strongest squad to date wont even make the bench.....Bogle, Pitman, Marshall, Robertson, East, Brown, Makreth, Pearson...the current likely bench warming candidates...... replaced with young unproven players ..... Con!

I like the early strengthening approach but unless there are unknown injuries or complications with exisiting ones then i cant help thinking Hurst has given himself a selection headache, not only regards the starting 11 but to who makes the bench as well...and this for a team that is just finding a nice run of form.  I would imagine there will be 2/3 heading out before long as a result.

Good post!!! :) :) :)

If we can keep them all for a year (feels like a big if) then we will be a very good odds on bet to get out of this league.  

Lots of players on one year deals who if not getting picked in Jan will look to move on loan to get in the shop window if that's what happens we just need to ensure the ones left are the cream of the crop.  

Quoted from chaos33

I do just want to add - in Amond, Bogle and Pittman we have three superb, contracted strikers. Unsurpassed as a '3' at this level almost certainly. I would like to see them given a chance to continue if they have a below par game in the interests of forging partnerships and understandings.The stats would say that, as goalscoreres, none of them have done too much wrong, and don't need replacing if fit.
.

That seems a tad at odds with the rest of your post. I believe you are quite right when you say that competition for places is fierce. The fact that we've recently signed two strikers on loan suggests nowhere will competition be more fierce than  up front. I think Hurst is sending out the message that there is little room for below par performances and that includes our strikers.
I'm sat wondering whether in Hursts view the idea of settled striking partnerships is any more important than say a central defensive or centre midfield partnership. Ruthlessness from someone who a lot of people consider a bit wishy washy.

Quoted from rancido

I'll have your bollock - it would be nice to have 4 !!!  lol

I have got 3 but will have one removed soon,

You can have that if you like  ;)

Quoted from barralad

That seems a tad at odds with the rest of your post. I believe you are quite right when you say that competition for places is fierce. The fact that we've recently signed two strikers on loan suggests nowhere will competition be more fierce than  up front. I think Hurst is sending out the message that there is little room for below par performances and that includes our strikers.
I'm sat wondering whether in Hursts view the idea of settled striking partnerships is any more important than say a central defensive or centre midfield partnership. Ruthlessness from someone who a lot of people consider a bit wishy washy.

Yes you're right as usual mate and I understand the point you're making there - I can see how that plea is perhaps a little at odds with reality. I suppose it's hard to explain - the idea that fierce competition and a big squad can be both propulsive at times, and destructive at others. It probably springs from the view I have of Amond, Bogle and Pittman, and really wanting to see them play.
I credit Hurst for signing them, and they are all good enough goal scorers to enable us to get promoted, so there's a part of me that doesn't want to see loanees playing instead of them. A flawed view I admit. Having 5 strikers means that nobody is going to get a 'run in the team' - a vital bit of scope for strikers I think. We'll see if the loanees are better than our current players, or if they are good cover in the fullness of time.

Of course, what I didn't mention, was that the number of players we now have (when fit) give us great tactical versatility and potential to change the way we play, or, take a 'horses for courses' approach. A great position to be in when weighing up opponents on a game by game basis.

The most interesting, and welcome of the loan signings for me is Henderson.
IMO we've been crying out for a particular kind of centre midfielder for quite some time. I hope this is him.  :)

Quoted from chaos33

Yes you're right as usual mate and I understand the point you're making there - I can see how that plea is perhaps a little at odds with reality. I suppose it's hard to explain - the idea that fierce competition and a big squad can be both propulsive at times, and destructive at others. It probably springs from the view I have of Amond, Bogle and Pittman, and really wanting to see them play.
I credit Hurst for signing them, and they are all good enough goal scorers to enable us to get promoted, so there's a part of me that doesn't want to see loanees playing instead of them. A flawed view I admit. Having 5 strikers means that nobody is going to get a 'run in the team' - a vital bit of scope for strikers I think. We'll see if the loanees are better than our current players, or if they are good cover in the fullness of time.

Of course, what I didn't mention, was that the number of players we now have (when fit) give us great tactical versatility and potential to change the way we play, or, take a 'horses for courses' approach. A great position to be in when weighing up opponents on a game by game basis.

The most interesting, and welcome of the loan signings for me is Henderson.
IMO we've been crying out for a particular kind of centre midfielder for quite some time. I hope this is him.  :)

I agree  100% about the horses for courses thing. I genuinely believe it is what Hurst has been after since the close season. If done properly at this level it gives us a massive advantage over most teams who can only dream of it. Time will tell whether the final piece in the jigsaw is managerial ability.  

Quoted from barralad

I agree  100% about the horses for courses thing. I genuinely believe it is what Hurst has been after since the close season. If done properly at this level it gives us a massive advantage over most teams who can only dream of it. Time will tell whether the final piece in the jigsaw is managerial ability.  

Whoa! Steady on there Barra  ;)

Quoted from ginnywings

Whoa! Steady on there Barra  ;)

It would only take someone like Johnson with a smaller squad to rubbish my argument. It's what Paul Hurst is up against...

Our squad is so strong now we could field two teams in this division  :)

Eleven v eleven down Cheapside would be a good watch!

Such a strong squad, that we can afford to field separate XI for FA Cup and League matches, and still have enough quality in both to win every match....I hope! Amond will be top scorer and will fetch me a good return on my bet, Bogle will develop into a Vardy-esque player and Hurst will be the next.....Alan Pardew?

What worried me today was that with the recent additions the bench looked very lopsided, ie 3 strikers and the fact Hurst felt it necessary to use all three of them.
The substitutions killed off any fluidity or rythm we had.  

Quoted from moosey_club

What worried me today was that with the recent additions the bench looked very lopsided, ie 3 strikers and the fact Hurst felt it necessary to use all three of them.
The substitutions killed off any fluidity or rythm we had.  

Agree................. I think Barra said something about managerial ability though I am not a massive fan of PH I think how he has tried to assemble this squad shows some nouse, ability and understanding.

We can't afford to sign Championship squad players on perm deals and their agents ensure we don't but brining some quality like Townsend, Jones and all being well Alibi may just lift us to the levels we need to hit.

The next test for the manger is keeping everybody until the end of the season contracted or loanee if we do this we will be serious contenders despite tonight being 5 points behind the leaders tonight.    

Wouldn't we be better off getting less players but better ones with bigger wages. No point paying people to sit in the stand.

Quoted from moosey_club

What worried me today was that with the recent additions the bench looked very lopsided, ie 3 strikers and the fact Hurst felt it necessary to use all three of them.

Agree about the bench. I don't think it was necessarily a case of him feeling he had to play all 3, just that the lopsidedness of the bench left him little choice when taking Arnold off.

Quoted from Abdul19

Agree about the bench. I don't think it was necessarily a case of him feeling he had to play all 3, just that the lopsidedness of the bench left him little choice when taking Arnold off.

Just guessing that Danny East may have been on the bench but for illness.

Quoted from MuddyWaters

Just guessing that Danny East may have been on the bench but for illness.

I suspect you're right but there's Marshall or Mackreth (who admittedly I'm not a massive fan of) too.

Any professional team will have a squad numbering in at least the low 20's, probably more, so if the matchday squad is 16, then it's inevitable that some will be sat in the stands. I can't see what the issue is. I think when Newell and Woods were in charge, we squads numbering in he 30's.

There will always be players out of the matchday squad.

Quoted from moosey_club

What worried me today was that with the recent additions the bench looked very lopsided, ie 3 strikers and the fact Hurst felt it necessary to use all three of them.
The substitutions killed off any fluidity or rhythm we had.  

Don't say that Moosey - you'll get 'lynched'  ;D

Quoted from HertsGTFC

Agree................. I think Barra said something about managerial ability though I am not a massive fan of PH I think how he has tried to assemble this squad shows some nouse, ability and understanding.

We can't afford to sign Championship squad players on perm deals and their agents ensure we don't but brining some quality like Townsend, Jones and all being well Alibi may just lift us to the levels we need to hit.

The next test for the manger is keeping everybody until the end of the season contracted or loanee if we do this we will be serious contenders despite tonight being 5 points behind the leaders tonight.    

To be clear I am a big fan of Paul Hurst (no sh1t Sherlock). I think the squad we have now is far and away the best since at least the second season under Slade and that is entirely due to Paul's ability to spot a player. The point I was trying to make (badly as it turns out!) was that although I'm pretty sure that a big squad of very decent players will be of a massive advantage in the second half of the season, there may be other factors that come into play such as Johnson's vast managerial experience with his smaller squad.

Andrew Newman is No. 37!