Hillsborough

Quoted from 97

Had to post on here.


This was the culmination of a decade long war against the working class. Of course Thatcher was in on it. She made the police her fûcking paratroopers. And they loved it as much as she did.

Those heads that are left must roll, and a similar inquiry into Orgreave please.

Going off thread a little but I was at Orgreave that day, the one always shown on telly, and I got a proper cunting from OB. We had been playing football on Bridlington beach and got brawling with some Barnsley miners when they found out we were steelworkers ( Orgreave was owned by the then British steel). All made up we said we'd join them on a picket and that was the one. The news footage always seems back to front as well. It always shows the miners charging first then the police charging. I remember it different.

Quoted from top man

Full sympathy for the families and relatives and any body involved, BUT  a lot of people turned up late- forged tickets, excess alcohol. desperate to get in close to kick off- and a decision was made , rightly or wrongly to open gates to ease congestion , Many times have Town fans been in a similar situation and it must of been horrendous- remember Derby ,Leicester ,. Wolves . Wednesday  etc in our heydays , To blame one Policeman who oversaw the day is a bit harsh in my opinion . A lot of things went wrong that day and affected a lot of people . is justice done  ? RIP the 96  

I call bullshit on this and refer you to this segment of the investigation done back in 1989!

https://twitter.com/ffion_/status/725047019883094016

Quoted from Green27

I call bullshit on this and refer you to this segment of the investigation done back in 1989!

https://twitter.com/ffion_/status/725047019883094016

If I'm reading that right there is an estimate of nearly 2,500 fans entering after gate C was opened and there is no evidence that can say whether any of those fans had tickets so no surprise that if they poured through that small tunnel that there was a crush and people died.

A barmy decision to open that gate and clearly crap policing outside and then lies by the illegitimates who organised it all.

Quoted from arryarryarry

If I'm reading that right there is an estimate of nearly 2,500 fans entering after gate C was opened and there is no evidence that can say whether any of those fans had tickets so no surprise that if they poured through that small tunnel that there was a crush and people died.

A barmy decision to open that gate and clearly crap policing outside and then lies by the illegitimates who organised it all.

But what it does say is for the stand 10,100 tickets were sold. The highest estimate they place on fans being in that stand is 10,124. They're saying 24 people may have got in without a ticket.

Quoted from arryarryarry

If I'm reading that right there is an estimate of nearly 2,500 fans entering after gate C was opened and there is no evidence that can say whether any of those fans had tickets so no surprise that if they poured through that small tunnel that there was a crush and people died.

A barmy decision to open that gate and clearly crap policing outside and then lies by the illegitimates who organised it all.

The main cause of the disaster was the failure to close access to Pens 3 and 4 when they were full and divert fans to the side pens. Exit Gate C had been opened numerous times before under similar circumstances to those outside the Leppings Lane turnstyles in 1989. There are countless photos showing the side pens were no where near full as the disaster unfolded. If you go on YouTube and watch the Panarama Hillsborough programme even John Motson preparing for commentary notices this and comments on it.

[url=https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bjdDyp22RI8]BBC Panarama- Hillsborough. How They Buried the Truth[/url] Skip to 04:32 for John Motson.

Quoted from ska face

So after the longest trial in British legal history, two years worth of evidence, millions of files, hundreds of witness statements, camera footage and advice from experts, 26 days of summing up and almost of month of deliberation by the jury...the verdicts are all irrelevant because, according RRFC, everyone liked the Beatles.

Unreal. You must've suffered brain damage in that crush of yours.

You have a way with words don't you. Pity the brain to keyboard connection is broken.

Read the post. Nothing to do with experts, juries or verdicts, none of which say anything about right wing politicians by the way.

I am talking about people who try to make people's suffering into some form of conspiracy. Next they will be saying that Number 10 ordered Duckenfield to open the gates. Yes it's that stupid. This was a social and football problem compounded by some lying policemen. All the rest is irrelevant make believe. The trouble is that the victims have become martyrs to the wrong cause.

You don't understand where this disaster came from do you? You don't understand how Hillsborough and lots of other grounds became death traps. Up until the mid-60s there was no segregation. You could go where you liked.  Liverpool was one of the  first big sources of crowd trouble in the 1960s and the Kop surge was copied by other 'firms' notable Man U, Leeds and the London clubs.. Pitch invasions became a weekly event all over. People were getting stabbed and battered. Ken Bates at Chelsea even put up an electrified fence at the Shed End to pen supporters in. Thank God he never turned it on. But that's what we got. Suddenly all of us turning up to watch a game of football found ourselves penned in like animals because there were some idiots who behaved like animals who were not there for the football anyway. Clearly you have no comprehension of that at all.

These 96 people were victims on the day of police incompetence but the whole situation was the result of the way supporters had behaved and were still behaving at that time and the way grounds were adapted to cope. If you had asked anyone on the morning of that game or any other big game what they were most afraid of the answer would not have been the police, it would have been crowd trouble. That is the era we were in. That was the atmosphere and that is why those people died so horribly. If there were no fences and pens then Duckenfield's actions or inactions would not have mattered. People would simply have spilled onto the pitch and been safe.

Yet today there are still people who think pitch invasions are OK, who think all stewards are a waste of space and all police are morons and a ruck with the opposition supporters is an integral part of a good day out. Well in my eyes these people are much more likely to be the cause of  tragedies like Hillsborough and Heysel than anyone else.

Quoted from TheRonRaffertyFanClub

You have a way with words don't you. Pity the brain to keyboard connection is broken.

Read the post. Nothing to do with experts, juries or verdicts, none of which say anything about right wing politicians by the way.

I am talking about people who try to make people's suffering into some form of conspiracy. Next they will be saying that Number 10 ordered Duckenfield to open the gates. Yes it's that stupid. This was a social and football problem compounded by some lying policemen. All the rest is irrelevant make believe. The trouble is that the victims have become martyrs to the wrong cause.

You don't understand where this disaster came from do you? You don't understand how Hillsborough and lots of other grounds became death traps. Up until the mid-60s there was no segregation. You could go where you liked.  Liverpool was one of the  first big sources of crowd trouble in the 1960s and the Kop surge was copied by other 'firms' notable Man U, Leeds and the London clubs.. Pitch invasions became a weekly event all over. People were getting stabbed and battered. Ken Bates at Chelsea even put up an electrified fence at the Shed End to pen supporters in. Thank God he never turned it on. But that's what we got. Suddenly all of us turning up to watch a game of football found ourselves penned in like animals because there were some idiots who behaved like animals who were not there for the football anyway. Clearly you have no comprehension of that at all.

These 96 people were victims on the day of police incompetence but the whole situation was the result of the way supporters had behaved and were still behaving at that time and the way grounds were adapted to cope. If you had asked anyone on the morning of that game or any other big game what they were most afraid of the answer would not have been the police, it would have been crowd trouble. That is the era we were in. That was the atmosphere and that is why those people died so horribly. If there were no fences and pens then Duckenfield's actions or inactions would not have mattered. People would simply have spilled onto the pitch and been safe.

Yet today there are still people who think pitch invasions are OK, who think all stewards are a waste of space and all police are morons and a ruck with the opposition supporters is an integral part of a good day out. Well in my eyes these people are much more likely to be the cause of  tragedies like Hillsborough and Heysel than anyone else.

Ummmmm well the most notable trouble of that era in Britain resulting in death would be Brum v Leeds when a wall collapsed and a young lad died which suggests no matter how bad the violence seemed it rarely if ever resulted in deaths.Hillsorough and Bradford from the same era both massive casualties and neither had anything to do with so called hooligans but more to do with poor organisation and crap stadiums.The fences at both games must have been a massive contributing factor and I don't know but suspect Clubs were told they must have them?

In many ways I can accept that this tragic event was caused by poor stadium design, poor organization. In many ways I can even accept people made mistakes during what happened which made it worse. This event's legacy has led to massive improvements in stadium safety and organization, and reviews will have learnt from the mistakes made so it will never happen again, if that's any consolation to the people who lost loved one.

What I cannot accept is that people seem have lied and covered up mistakes to cover their own backs and should be held accountable.

Views from Forest fans.

http://www.forest.vitalfootball.co.uk/forum/forums/thread-view.asp?tid=32146&start=1

Police incompetence caused the unlawful killing of 96 football fans at Hillsborough. Never, ever, lose sight of that, because that is exactly what happened. Whether or not you don't / didn't like Scousers that is totally irrelevant, because people lost their lives that day because of the police.

Was there a cover up? Of course there was, and it went straight to the very top of the tree at Downing Street. Don't forget that you can't keep politics out of certain things, and the police were Thatchers stormtroopers during the 1980's. When she was taking on the dockers, the miners, the steelworkers she was using the police - to whom she'd given huge pay rises in her early years - to smash them. Murdoch called in favours from Thatcher to take on the print unions at Wapping in 1986, and the police were used extensively there. They all drunk in the same pot, and it's no surprise that Murdoch would have repaid the favour to Thatcher with the Hillsborough allegations - which she quickly pounced upon of course.

96 folk needlessly lost their lives that day, and it has been kept under cover for 27 years. As football fans we all owe a huge thankou to those who fought for justice.